Ascot Forum

First Generation Ascots => The Thumper Years: Modified To Full Customs => Topic started by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on September 10, 2014, 05:27:31 pm

Title: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on September 10, 2014, 05:27:31 pm
I'll post up here as dawdle along  with this project. Already had some good advice here. I havent found so many FT's going my way, so any inputs good  ;)
Pretty pleased I chose the FT500.  Wanted the touque & frame, and the age...and the cost. 60% cheaper than an XL500s / XR600r here.

Touque: needed something that was going get me into the mountains at a good rate on the slab, haul arse up dirt / fire roads  camping and hunting down ghost towns & ruins... The age, I needed a 30yr plus bike to get me into a local Vintage MX / dirt track / beach race  thingy we have throughout the yr... my old girl has deserves a better life and she'll be rebuilt for my yongest son.
( picture here ... young kid pumped & pestering for his first bike lol )

I found the bike had been sitting for quite a few yrs & had a few parts spirited away (starter pinion & clutch bits ) cracked fork brace, busted fork valve, nothing major.
Picked up a FT400 motor cheap enough to fill in the blanks, new piston and rings, everything else looked pretty good, blasted & paint, started up well enough & confirmed  a low milage motor  :o

Now at point where I'll register it, here it must be done in complete original form or it wont pass. From there I'll start to fool around ( measure twice, cut once ) with changes I'd like to make. As the Subject says.. this is how I expect it to turn out.. no disrespect to the purists  ;)
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: thumperdh on September 10, 2014, 08:35:51 pm
Subscribed, this one looks interesting. Keep us posted.
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: J6G1Z on September 11, 2014, 07:31:57 am
Sounds like an interesting build. I'm not a big fan of taking Ascots off-road, but that's because they make such a good handling canyon carver with sticky street tires on them. I suppose with some real shocks on the back & some fork work they would do all right off-road, just a bit on the heavy side. When you get going on modifying the bike, make sure you check out the Ascot Essentials: http://ascot500.com/index.php?topic=10.0  and perform the jetting & countershaft swap. I use a 16 tooth & I'm quite pleased with the results.

Good luck with your build & please post up plenty of pictures.
J.
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: Lefty on September 11, 2014, 04:51:03 pm
Welcome brother! You mentioned an FT400 parts donor, I never knew or heard of a 400cc FT?
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: Lefty on September 11, 2014, 05:00:50 pm
New Zealand! Here's  a stock shot
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: Lefty on September 11, 2014, 05:02:20 pm
It must be a sleeved down 500? This is very cool to find out!
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on September 11, 2014, 08:58:13 pm
Cheers fellas, I'll post along.

Here they released the 400 & the 500, the 400 being more common, mainly because the Japanese bike licence goes by cc class; 250, 400, 400~ and by related cost and differculty. 400cc licence being the most common.
Exactly the same bike, same piston & crank etc,  just a shorter rod & barrel.

Seems like always one being parted out localy .. Just about crapped myself when I saw some of the price gouging on US fleabay though 

Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on September 16, 2014, 01:52:02 am
Thought I was scr@wed getting a fork valve but the CBX250 had the same. Loverly little Honda engineers
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on December 09, 2014, 11:51:49 pm
Made the little beasty road legal today, passed inspection, and took it for a first spin.
Had a ball, really impressed by the torque & and the turn in,
shes geared for the highway ATM,  really long legs.

I'll see if I can fit the Supertrapp & XL pipes on tonight.
All good
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: J6G1Z on December 10, 2014, 04:03:01 am
That's a good looking FT!

Did you have a chance to change the jetting & the countershaft gear yet? That will wake that engine up a little bit. As you are finding out... They are really great bikes!

Good luck
J.
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on December 10, 2014, 05:21:52 am
Cheers,

Had to bring the headers in about 10mm and fit bigger flanges.

I have to take out the airbox tomorrow to see if I can wind the Supertrapp behind the cylinder.
So I'll stick on a K&N.  Any recommends for jetting with that?
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: J6G1Z on December 10, 2014, 06:43:50 am
What are you trying to do? Mount up a high pipe or mid pipe? Why are you wanting to do that? Down pipes don't let water get into the engine.

The stock bikes run pretty good with the stock twin-wall down tubes & an after-market muffler.

There is also a very nice performance header available from ThumperStuff: http://www.thumperstuff.com/FT500.html

The common jetting upgrade is the Main & Low-Speed jets changed to a #145 & a #58 like is described in this posting: http://ascot500.com/index.php?topic=10.0 This works well with the air-box in place. I removed my air box & fit a UNI filter (I do not recommend K&N filters. They pass too much dirt into the engine.) and my jetting needs to be worked on. I have a dead spot about mid throttle that needs to be resolved.

Good luck
J.
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on December 10, 2014, 03:58:10 pm
when I get the jetting right with the K&N I'll post it up
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on December 11, 2014, 06:41:05 am
The XL Supertrapp was APIA to wrap around the frame,  so I went with a slimline Japanese "Supersound" / 7 disc's.
So didnt remove the airbox & fit the K&N filter.

Sounds good, same throttle response. Paint and prettyness later
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: Lefty on December 14, 2014, 06:50:51 am
That looks wild! Why are you going upswept with the exhaust? Looks like you might need a heat shield for your leg, lol
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: J6G1Z on December 14, 2014, 07:17:32 am
That looks wild! Why are you going upswept with the exhaust? Looks like you might need a heat shield for your leg, lol

That's what I was thinking. A heat shield will probably be needed.

J.
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on December 14, 2014, 08:26:34 am
That looks wild! Why are you going upswept with the exhaust? Looks like you might need a heat shield for your leg, lol

Cheers, always had Triumphs,   Bonnies" & Trophys with twin side pipes, they've always been my favorite setup...  and if I'm having a single its going to sound like a thumper  ;)  .. we're making sweet thumper music now..

I got the leg covered, I'll work on a full length sheild after a bit of thought.. headlight this week
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: scottly on December 14, 2014, 06:11:12 pm
Cheers,

Had to bring the headers in about 10mm and fit bigger flanges.


Is the port spacing different from the XL to the FT?
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on December 14, 2014, 07:12:58 pm
Cheers,

Had to bring the headers in about 10mm and fit bigger flanges.


Is the port spacing different from the XL to the FT?

well it shouldnt have been.... I got that header & a Supertrapp on an Auction as "82 XL500s", .. XR600? maybe? not much effort anyway
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on December 22, 2014, 03:32:05 pm
Frame loop & taillight.
Sliced & diced 18kgs off so far but... but backslid a tad on this old taillight...eh what the heck
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: Lefty on December 23, 2014, 04:43:51 am
Slick, I love it!
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on December 31, 2014, 01:32:37 am
Seat & mudguard mockup; lost 8"X 2" of the seat, and will go with this guard from a Kawasaki 250TR  ;)

Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: Lefty on December 31, 2014, 01:51:27 pm
Very cool, I'm liking the seat!
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on January 03, 2015, 06:13:30 pm
Cheers EL Lefty! found this, same era, should cut down on front mass  :P
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on January 03, 2015, 09:44:07 pm
40% less mass + 1/4 the weight
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: J6G1Z on January 04, 2015, 06:35:48 am
Please let me know how that battery performs for you.

I bought an AntiGravity small case 12 cell for my FT Ascot. The LI battery does not like the cold weather. My battery set for about 3/4 of a year before I used it. Then the winter weather rolled in. The last time that I tried to start the bike in 35-40 degree temperatures, it would not spin it fast enough. The battery has been returned to the factory for inspection/replacement.

When the battery first arrived, it spun the engine real fast, as it is rated at 360 CCA. It is real small & weighs slightly less than 3 pounds. I mounted it sideways to the cross tube behind the engine. This placed the battery right above & inline with the swing-arm pivot.

For some reason that I'm not aware of, you cannot use a standard battery charger or trickle charger on these LI batteries. It would be a good idea to remove it from the bike & bring into the house over the winter.

Good luck
J.
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on January 04, 2015, 03:08:42 pm
Your right they dont like the cold. If you had a hard starter, and minus conditions you might be left hangn

That bike was starting on the 1st/2nd crank anytime with the normal battery last week, at around 10 C'.
Now its -1 C' here in the morning, its still starting 3rd crank ok, but just turning over slow to do it.
After the 1st start it turns over quick & fires 1st crank

But I've a Shorai in a 1200 and its been bangn away fine for 3yrs now
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: Lefty on January 04, 2015, 04:22:35 pm
Odd(for me, in the staes) speedo, looks kind of Yamaha-ish?
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on January 04, 2015, 06:30:52 pm
yeah you could be right there, the wiring colors are odd.

Honda pretty much uses the same colors all the way through their models I think.
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on January 09, 2015, 09:12:44 pm
Chose this Dunlop D605, good reviews for durability on the road & should be good when, I get to where I want to be. 
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: J6G1Z on January 10, 2015, 05:22:01 am
That's a pretty gnarly looking tire for the street. Please let us know how it rides & corners.

J.
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on January 11, 2015, 05:52:58 pm
Tire answers here J

First good tryout for ma project;                                                                                                                                                 

100klm/80mph on the slab; comfortable

80klm/30~50mph on twisties; Carved really well, could go in and out hot on most corners. Good rake on the FT500. Both tires spot on. Frnt forks a little soft, Rr was ok

50klms on back roads & fire trails; A ton of tourque, Rr tire great, Frnt bigger blocks needed. Stiffer forks/shocks. Need to grow 3 teeth on the back sprocket ( 6.75 tourque increase & 9mph drop in top speed/85mph ) could be about right, we'll see?
Wheels & brakes; Good, thought they's be too heavy & I'd change the out, but power to weight is great, might stick with them
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on January 11, 2015, 05:56:10 pm
more pics of a great day out
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: J6G1Z on January 12, 2015, 06:15:05 am
I installed an '89 CBR600 Hurricane forks on the front of my FT & Hagon shocks on the back. It handles excellent on the street. I would not recommend the CBR forks for an off-road bike, due to them lowering the bike & reducing ground clearance by about 2". Maybe some Progressive or RaceTech front springs & experiment with the fork oil viscosity. That should straighten out the front end.

Good luck... I still think that classic bike looks too clean to be out in the dirt, but it looks like you take good care of it.

J.
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: Lefty on January 14, 2015, 12:46:08 pm
Looking killer! I love that  rear tire & the front fender looks sweet trimmed up, very nice!
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on January 16, 2015, 08:07:00 pm
Tried some flat track last nite on some slimmy grass, frnt tire clogs up and slides out ;)
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on January 26, 2015, 04:13:20 pm
PIAA H3 Exteme white into oldschool bucket, already tried this out without the bucket in the boonies, has plenty of range & clear white light
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on February 03, 2015, 03:21:12 pm
FT "s for Flattrack right? so I was curious how it was, and It wasnt too bad either, other than the track marshal asked me to come off after about 10 laps or so cause my rear was ripping up the surface. But it was great still needed maybe 4-5 more teeth on the back for that kinda tom foolery though
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: Lefty on February 19, 2015, 04:05:35 pm
I gotta admit, the more I look at the exhaust, the more I like it!
Thanks for the shots, that's one badass FT!
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on March 06, 2015, 05:26:02 pm
Cleaned up the headlight & triple tree with a back plate and added cage to the headlight bucket.

Think I'll try those forks with 10 weight oil & maybe a 1/2 inch spacer for starters.
I have 5 weight in the now forks which according to a Japanese blog is the recommended weight
( however.. the average japanese guy is on 60-65kgs wet )

330cc & level 120mm from the top of fork tube

Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on March 17, 2015, 05:23:31 pm
At 12.5 oil in the forks now with a 1.2" spacer & some better rear shocks. Cleaned up the headlight bucket and added a cage.
Dropped the ignition below the tank, added a digital gauge
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on March 17, 2015, 05:25:32 pm
Ignition
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: J6G1Z on March 18, 2015, 03:18:31 am
Looks like that gauge just barely clears the tank. What model of gauge is that? Looks nice.


What power plant is that in the background?

J.
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: WTF304 on March 18, 2015, 07:47:34 am
Huh? ..... lol I'm lost. The gauge is mounted at the bars close to the original units location. Power plant in the background ?
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: WTF304 on March 18, 2015, 05:20:39 pm
Nvm lol
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on March 20, 2015, 02:02:36 am
the gauge is about 1 1/2" off the tank, its a Takegawa;
rev counter
milage / speed
indicator
nuetral
High beam

That thar is a water purification plant, theres an old grass airstrip down in front of it,
took it down to fool around with the jetting and get straight runs
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: J6G1Z on March 20, 2015, 06:24:14 am
That was my other thought. It looked like either a power generating station or a water purification plant.

J.
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on May 29, 2015, 06:45:59 pm
dig it when bike stuff gets delivered  :)  FCR 39mm
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on June 17, 2015, 02:37:49 pm
adaptor $ 60... ouch
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: Lefty on June 19, 2015, 06:37:00 am
Very cool, I'm looking forward to your ride report!
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: Lefty on June 29, 2015, 03:45:03 pm
How are you liking that FCR, any updates?
Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: wrk2ride_ride2wrk on July 02, 2015, 03:36:28 pm
Cheers Lefty, hell I wanta fit it  however .... its rainy season here now, cats and dogs everyday ..causing my work to get in the way of my life ATM.. :-\ ASAP  ;)

Title: Re: Grittty not pretty build
Post by: Lefty on March 09, 2016, 01:19:47 pm
Any updates?